SUMMARY KEYWORDS
carson wentz, draft, season, quarterback, sanders, year, jalen hurts, kirk cousins, dallas, eagles, melvin gordon, miles, tight, touchdowns, bit, wide receivers, handcuff, play, point, kevin
Intro 00:05
You’re listening to the good old boys fantasy football podcast. Now here’s your host, Kevin, Derek and Alex.
Derek 00:13
Alrighty. Welcome in ladies and gentlemen to another episode of the good old boys fantasy football podcast. I’m Derek and I’m joined as always by your co host, Kevin, Alex. All right, guys, if you haven’t had a chance already, make sure to chop on to Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, give us a follow there at GoodOldBoysFF we’ve also got the website for you, goodoldboysff.com. And we’ve got some content coming to the YouTube channel here very shortly with the good old boys fantasy football podcast YouTube channel. So make sure that you’re checking that out there as well. We’ve got a great show for you coming at you tonight. We’re gonna break down the team of the week and that is the Philadelphia Eagles. And yeah, I’m sure you would like to. That’s there’s a there’s a lot of a lot of pieces here that that do have some fantasy intrigue and some fantasy relevance for next year. We’ll go and start where we always do and that’s in the running back room with Miles Sanders. So miles Sanders last year was running back 23 164 rushing attempts, 867 yards, six rushing touchdowns, 28 receptions on 52 targets for an additional 197 yards. Guys, your thoughts on Miles Sanders?
Kevin 01:32
I think Miles Sanders might be a little intriguing this year. Now that they’re out of the shadow of Doug Peterson and his running back by committee approach, we might get to see the training wheels taken off of him a little bit. The problem with Miles Sanders in general is he just seems to get nicked up a little bit right? Like no he’s not. He’s not a small running back. He’s five he’s five foot 11 211 pounds. So he’s not the biggest running back out there. But but he’s not tiny and frail. Right? So he can take it between the tackles. We saw his explosiveness guys like he had some monster runs every time Derek said fade him, he went off so he provides some pop. I think the quarterback determines how much success Miles Sanders will have. And trying to fit into that scheme as well as is the receiving corps going to take that next step forward. The biggest problem with the Philadelphia Eagles is if you aren’t threatened outside, then you let the safeties creep up and it makes it really, really hard for Miles Sanders to get anything done. And you hope for a big play like that. But those are not guaranteed. Those aren’t scripted like that. It’s that’s a player making a play. I think Miles Sanders is he’s in that running back to conversation. I think there’s potential for him to maybe crack that RB one territory. But for me, and how I would draft Miles Sanders, there’s so many other things that I’d like is I think I’m going to try and wait on Miles Sanders and see if I can get him to fall to me in the fourth or fifth kind of right there. And that turn, he might be picked up by them because running backs are so scarce. And if he is I understand that, but there’s so many unknowns about how this Philadelphia Eagles team is going to run who’s going to play quarterback who’s actually going to be standing outside at wide receiver and all the offensive line questions that they’ve had. Like there’s so many issues that for now, as we sit here today, I’m looking at Miles Sanders, like at the end of the fourth beginning of the fifth as a, you know, middle to Yeah, middle ish RB two is kind of where I have him at the moment.
Alex 03:46
So that’s the big Crux to all of this that the fantasy players will have to pay attention to. And it was the last thing that you really mentioned that Kevin, the offensive line, which has been just in shambles over the last two seasons, the offensive line is actually going to be really, really determined and how effective Miles Sanders is going to be. The offensive line is a major major part to this and it’s unfortunate because you know the offensive line means nothing and everything to fantasy football players all at the same time. So that’s going to be the big issue the way that we have to approach this season and what you’re going to have to look into with the new head coach with Nick sirianni taking over there and Philadelphia is you have to look at his password was password was the OCC at Indianapolis where they were able to have 1000 yard rusher Now, that being said Indianapolis is offensive line was pretty stellar. So I hope that that’s something Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I hope that’s something that gets addressed with the Eagles this offseason is that they can stir up some of those things on the offensive line. Now. It wasn’t for a lack of they didn’t have the right guys in place. They just have bad weather. with injuries, for the most part, the Eagles did when it came to their offensive line was, you know, was a Brandon Brooks. I mean, he hasn’t played that much at all really the last two seasons, you know, he was he got signed a huge contract to be their left tackle. And, you know, they, they russell peters is up there in age yet they continue to try and roll him out there. So I hope that that they’re able to address those issues on the offensive line. And that will allow them to be pretty balanced offense that I think sirianni wants to bring there. I think he wants to be fairly balanced. In his play calling. I mean, he had 1000 yard rusher last year. And Jonathan Taylor, obviously, when you have future Hall of Famer and Philip Rivers calling calling plays for you last year, that can probably hide a lot of flaws in your system, because he is so smart and is able to get guys in there. Right? The right play called into whatever defense he’s seeing. Um, I don’t know that there’s that level of student is under center in Philadelphia just yet. It’s hard to replicate 17 years in the NFL and seeing what defenses throw at you. But I think that, you know, his concepts are going to be geared towards trying to move the football down the field in different ways. That’s a pretty, you know, 1000 foot view of what every offensive team is trying to do. But I think that that’s what we’re gonna see. So I think Miles Sanders, while the injury bug is obviously president, that you’re probably going to get him for 13 games, maybe in a year, I still think he has the value of third or fourth round, if the Eagles address the offensive line.
Derek 06:45
I remember going into this last season, when we were doing some of our rankings and put those things out there. We had several kind of Twitter battles out there when it came to the ranking that we had on Miles Sanders, which we go into the season had him consensus consensus ranking between the three of us as running back 14, which was actually right where he was drafted. As far as an ADP goes, who’s the 1420? And back off the board. 22nd. overall pick? Yeah, I remember us just having a lot of those conversations that, you know, if you take Miles Sanders, you take him early, you’re, you’re probably not going to be very happy with with where you have to take him. Does he have a ton of upside? Yes. Does he have a ton of potential Yes. But looking back at this season short of an 80 yard run and a 76 yard run. He’s these two runs away from having only two games inside of the top 12. As far as a running back is concerned, on the weekend, that’s not something that you’re looking for. And minus those two things out there, drops him into running back three territory on the season as well. So he’s a guy that I’m not looking to try and to try and spend up on anything like that if I can get if I’m at playing dynasty, and I’ve got somebody that’s willing to overpay a little bit. I’m going to take that offer and run with it. But for me, he’s a guy that I think I’m right there with you, Kevin, I’m not gonna look at him earlier than about the fourth round. But I don’t think he’ll be there because I think he’s gonna be probably, you know, drafted about that same area that, you know, like Melvin Gordon or David Johnson was taking going into this year, which firmly puts him in like the third round.
Alex 08:26
I like that you brought up those two names, because which of those three Would you rather have now?
Derek 08:32
Yeah, Melvin Gordon is a guy that, you know, at least when he’s inside the red zone, he’s inside the 10. He’s going to find a way to score because he’s got the notes for the end zone. So yeah, I think I think I’m right there with you. I think I’d rather probably take Melvin Gordon over Miles Sanders. I’ll see probably about the same number of games played and you’ll see the Melvin Gordon find the end zone probably two or three more times.
Kevin 08:54
And that’s exactly why I was saying Melvin Gordon right away is it’s the touchdowns it Melvin Gordon, through all of his frustrating outputs at times for fantasy owners. The guy finds the end zone. He is clearly the Broncos lead running back right now. They’re going to put him in those goal line situations. He can catch the ball out of the backfield and go from there he had, I’d have to look at Melvin Gordon receptions for 2020 to kind of see where that stacks up. But for Miles Sanders specifically, Miles Sanders missed four games in 2020. Okay, he had 28 receptions in 12 games. So break that down and you’re looking at basically two and a half almost three receptions per game over under 40 and a half receptions for 2021 four mile Sanders.
Derek 09:47
If it’s Carson Wentz over Jalen Hurts under Yes, I think it’s still gonna be Carson Wentz. But we’ll get to that. I think you’ve got too much money tied up in him not to and Kevin, just to kind of bring that to life. For you, you were talking about the Melvin Gordon receptions. Melvin Gordon last year in 2020 was 32 receptions on 44 targets. But he did play quite a few more games than Miles Sanders did.
Kevin 10:13
So and and that just adds to the style of your fantasy league. And we’ll get into that more as we get closer to it. But those are all things where that helps Miles Sanders. If he’s healthy, keep up with Melvin Gordon, is you may not see the touchdown output. But if Miles Sanders can reach that 40 reception threshold, Melvin Gordon may not consistently get there because we don’t know who’s playing quarterback for the Denver Broncos at this point. So it tit for tat I could there’s gonna be people who would pound the table for Miles Sanders and say we’re out of our minds. I’m talking redraft format only. I’m not talking dynasty purposes. But in redraft format only. I think Melvin Gordon has a safer floor, but a lower ceiling. So it depends on like how we talk depends on what you want your roster construction to be. Are you looking for a running back who you know, is dependable? Or do you have your dependable running back and you’re looking for that home run hitter that can kind of put up decent numbers, but then those big weeks truly get you over the top? So that’s where I’m, you know, splitting splitting hairs at that point.
Derek 11:28
Before we move on there. Over under a Miles Sanders next year 200 rushing attempts over under
Kevin 11:34
under
Alex 11:35
Yeah, I’m under.
Derek 11:36
So I mean, it’s one of those two, he’s a he’s an efficient back. But in order for him to get to 1000 yard season, even this last year was running at 5.3 yards per rush attempt. If we’re gonna say that he doesn’t get to 200 rushing attempts, does he get to 1000 yards on the ground. So that’s again, one of those that that’s tough for me to, to kind of sign off for that, as a guy that I’m going to take for my running, really running back to on my roster if you happen to draft them in the, you know, the third, the second or third round, which I think is where he’s probably going to fall when we get to draft season. And the answer for me is no, that’s a guy that I’m wanting more as a flex type of play. Yeah, a second running back if I loaded up at wide receiver in your two wide receivers in the first three rounds. So no at that point, I think it kind of just solidifies the point in my mind that you’re looking at a fourth rounder there. Moving on over to Boston Scott. Boston Scott last year finishes running back 5180 rushing attempts, 374 yards on the ground, one rushing, touchdown, 25 receptions. 36 targets are with 212 yards through the air and an additional one receiving touchdown, guys your thoughts on Boston Scott?
Kevin 12:51
He’s the succubus, right like he’s the guy that you’re not gonna draft like you might take him late and that’s entirely possible. You take him late, maybe you try and handcuff Miles Sanders with him later on. use him for that type of value. But standalone value for Boston Scott, I don’t think there is one. His volume came when Miles Sanders was out. Or you know the beginning of the season because Miles Sanders missed that first game of the season. So the first five weeks he had a little bit more value, because they were bringing Miles Sanders back slowly from his ham, hamstring or quad injury. And I apologize I don’t remember which one. But that’s where he did some of the damage. And then later on when Miles Sanders was out, Boston Scott kind of made some hay there but he he’s a flyer on a handcuff if you’re on deep bench, if you’re not on a deep bench, you’re not drafting Boston Scott, you’re gonna let him sit on the waiver wire. And then you’re just going to kind of pay attention to how the game flows going, how this new coaching staffs handling the running back room, what the snap percentages look like. And then that’s where you make an assessment because there’s no guarantee that Boston Scott’s going to be on the field more than you know, 13% of the snaps. If you’re only on the field 13% of snaps. It’s not a guy that I’m looking to draft for any reason. There’s just not there’s not enough usage out of that the floor is so so low that it’s it’s just a situation where I would choose to go a different route.
Alex 14:24
I think Boston Scott’s main value come that comes as a handcuff for Miles Sanders and and I know that because I had to use him that way a little bit this year. And I’ll tell you, I’ll tell you this. Don’t try to employ this strategy that I tried to do this last year of taking in the draft. Guys handcuffs, I went with Alexander Madison, I went with Boston Scott I didn’t have a Miles Sanders or Dalvin Cook on on the particular roster that I did that with and that doesn’t work out if those guys who do have those running backs. Won’t won’t trade with you so view him only as a handcuff don’t view him as Oh, I can take him and maybe try to flip him later because it just is the value that isn’t there. Even with super late super deep benches. There are so many other guys that I wish I would have taken instead of a Boston Scott thinking, Oh, I’ll be able to flip him to the guy who has Miles Sanders later in the season or right away if Miles Sanders isn’t isn’t healthy. But that that is not a strategy that I would suggest. Even though I did win that league is it’s not a bold shade. It’s a bold strategy that didn’t pay off. They just ended up being, you know, bench benchwarmers for most of the year because they don’t have individual value. At least. Boston Scott didn’t. Madison did it at times, but dalvin cook was so prominent that it didn’t matter. In Boston, Scott is handcuff or waiver wire
Derek 16:03
Boston’s got finished right about where you would have drafted him. Now he was the 52nd running back off the board he finished at 51. His average draft position was 168. So it’s not like you were really reaching for him at all that at any point you were drafted meant to be that handcuff kind of talking to that strategy. Alex, when you’re talking handcuffs, if you’re not handcuffed in your own your own running back, what you’re talking about there is actually one of my favorite strategies when it comes to a basketball type of League. where, you know, you’re you’re handcuffing it, and then if somebody goes down, you’ve got the you’ve got the valuable asset there. So there’s a there’s a place in a league format for what you’re talking about. But redraft? No, I wouldn’t agree with that. That’s the place to do it. Boston Scott, if I can have him played the New York football giants every week of the season that I’m probably going to put them in those are really his only two kind of standout games that he had, really any fantasy relevance in. Otherwise, he was kind of relegated to, you know, change of pace back, handcuffed type of thing. And actually, it was interesting with looking at a snap count, right. Miles Sanders had 602 snaps on the on the season. Boston Scott was 383. So there wasn’t as much of a disparity as I was really expecting to see between those two but Miles Sanders missing some time to help to bring that a little bit closer there too.
Alex 17:29
But I also think that and this is something that I wish we would have prefaced, you know, going into this conversation with was that the Eagles were terrible offensively this year. They were so bad, that I almost feel like it’s unfair to, you know, judge what they’re going to be next year versus what they were this year, this past year because they forced so bad. You know, Carson Wentz was terrible. Miles Sanders wasn’t great. He was inconsistent. Boston Scott. I mean, was Boston. He was what they asked him to be, but the Eagles were so terrible offensively. That it it’s almost unfair to judge them off of what they were. But you know, that’s the data point that we have right is is last year’s last year’s results. So it’s it is something that you need to keep in mind when you’re dealing with drafting Eagles players heading into this next year.
Derek 18:28
I think you bring up a good point there too, because your elite talent guys, a lot of times can transcend what’s around them. Right like you think back to say Quan, you’re healthy say Quan has been on bad giants teams for several years and has had a lot of pop. Christian McCaffrey really hasn’t been on great Panthers teams, and has had a lot of pop there. So there’s a lot of these guys that that are on bad teams but still have a lot of fantasy relevance even though the team around them isn’t great. And so it’s one of those that I don’t know that Miles Sanders is in that elite type of deal. And I’m not shocking anybody by saying that. But it’s one of those that he is far more going to have to rely on what’s around him and the circumstances that surround him in that more so than the talent of the player. Guys any desire to talk about Jordan Howard or Corey klymit? No, no, didn’t think so. Let’s go ahead and move on us past. Okay. Move on over to the wide receivers. We’ll go ahead and start with the rookie that they drafted early with the first round pick Jalen Reagor finishes the 88th wide receiver last season 31 receptions 54 targets 396 yards to the air one touchdown. So guys, your thoughts on Jalen Reagor
Kevin 19:52
I think Jalen reagor is is the one kind of bright spot right? It’s the one thing that we’re looking to get some answers for with This Philadelphia Eagles team, he was banged up just a little bit came through towards the end of the season with some pretty strong performances. So it’ll be interesting to see how whether it’s Carson Wentz and or Jalen Hurts can create some chemistry with that and try and play off of that, because he’s definitely the guy who gives them the most opportunity for success. And it’s, I don’t know, I’m kind of interested to see what Reagor does. He’s got some great speed, ran some pretty clean routes, all things considered, he has some decent hands. I won’t say that the best hands we’ve ever seen, but they’re pretty solid, and provided a spark to this Philadelphia team here kind of late in the season, once he got healthy and got his feet underneath him.
Alex 20:44
I think the momentum that he lost, you know, playing the first two weeks and then missing five straight really, really set his development back. And I think that during that course of the five weeks, there was obviously the turmoil of the offensive line wasn’t good. Miles Sanders wasn’t good. Carson Wentz was terrible. And I think you know that him not being there kind of really setback, his development. We did see some sparks towards the end of the year after they made kind of the quarterback change. But he’s, he’s obviously, you know, there, there’s very few rookie receivers that come in and have the impact. And I think it’s unfair that we might be looking at all rookie receivers and basing them off of Justin Jefferson, who was a first round pick, who lit the league on fire last year, and had a really awesome rookie campaign. Whereas I think it takes a little bit more time for some of these guys to develop to understand route concepts. I’ll be honest, I think he went into a very complex and confusing offense. I think that was part of the problem, which is why I think they had a little bit more success when they kind of simplified it and dumbed it down when they brought Jalen Hurts in. But I don’t know if you can catch on to a theme here. I’m going to blame Doug Peterson for everything and not Carson Wentz for everything. But I think I think that that was part of the issue is that his growth was kind of stunted by missing those five weeks at a pretty crucial time in the season. And it’s just hard to come back in and try and you know, step into things in week, a week, nine week 10 whatever it was when he came back, week eight, maybe. So it will be interesting to see his development. I think there’s value there with him. But I’m not. I’m not sure what his value is. And I’m not sure we’re going to know what his value you know really solidifies is until we know who is throwing the football again, I think it will be Carson Wentz
Derek 22:51
question for you. Would you rather have had kj hamler last year or? Jalen Reagor?
Kevin 22:57
Well, statistically hamler had a better season. Right? So better
Derek 23:02
really close it was 88 versus 86. Both of them haven’t right around the same number of receptions. Similar targets, similar targets and similar yards. So on paper, they actually looked very, very similar there.
Kevin 23:16
I think I’d rather have Reagor I think his upsides a little bit more kj hamler stepping in the third wheel in Denver. Well, Jalen Reagor has a clear path to be the number one in Philadelphia Reagor has a bit better of a paid pedigree. Yes, the injury bug, sometimes wide receivers just take that year, right. They, they don’t always pop right away. Um, I don’t think that 2020 was any indication of how 2021 is going to go. And all things considered. I think I’d rather take Reagor and be okay with that.
Derek 23:48
Yeah, I don’t really have much on Jalen Reagor. It’s one of those that were what does this season really kind of bring out didn’t necessarily have the pop like we’ve seen a lot of rookie wide receivers, especially workI wide receivers taking the first round over the last couple of years. So I think there’s a lot to be said there and a lots going to be determined here kind of what happens over this season. Especially when you’re talking you know, dynasty type of deal but when it comes to a redraft league I yeah, it’s one of those that I’ll take like a late round flier on him and see what see what comes with that. But yeah, I’m probably not looking to draft him earlier than round 1112, something like that. So no,
Kevin 24:31
I mean, I’m just trying to think where where I think riggers can land in the draft. I think he’s gonna go higher than 11th. Maybe because he’s still a number one option coming into so yeah, if he falls to the 11th absolutely snatch him up. But I think based off of just kind of what I’m thinking and how that draft is going to play out coming into next year. I think you’re probably going to have to take him in the eighth if he’s a guy that you have on your targets. List of players that you’re trying to get.
Derek 25:02
That was that was the number that was in my mind as well was the eighth round somewhere in there as far as where I think he’ll get taken. But as far as any of my roster contracts are now he’s going to be a later add than that for me, guys. Let’s go ahead and move on over to Sean Jackson. The Shawn Jackson was 100 and 20th. Last year when it comes to fantasy, played most of the season hurt. The real question I have for you guys. Is he worth looking at when it comes to next season in 2021
Kevin 25:33
and a redraft? I’m not looking towards deshawn Jackson he’s too injury prone to boom or bust. But if you’re playing a basketball league deshawn Jackson is not a guy to pick up late and have some some good pop some good upside, you know, he’s good for one or two, spectacular deep season, especially if he can stay healthy. There’s been no indication over the last what three or four years that he’s been able to do that so I wouldn’t get him for best ball redraft. I’d rather take a gamble or a chance on a young unproven guy who I think has some upside wants to add DeSean Jackson
Derek 26:17
any desire to talk about Alshon Jeffrey or JJ Arcega-Whiteside no pass over to the tight ends, we’re moving to that room and we’ll talk about Zach Ertz for a sec, or it’s finishing as tight end 32 last year, 36 receptions on 72 targets 335 yards, one touchdown, guys, your thoughts on Zach Ertz.
Kevin 26:42
I think father time is caught up to him in a big way. Zach Ertz got nipped by the injury bug a little bit. But even when healthy. It really just seemed like Ertz and Carson Wentz did not have the same chemistry that they have had in years past. in most respects, he was taken as a top three or four tight end. And to finish as tight in three is a struggle again, largely in part due to his stint on the IR but it’s possible he comes back to life a little bit, they have two really good tight ends on that team overall. And I do think that because of that they’re going to cannibalize each other a little bit, if, especially if they’re both healthy. So I could see Ertz towards the back end of tied in one territory. But I don’t think that you’re going to see much more out of him than that because Dallas Goedert has continues to emerge as the best Titan on that team for for what it is right now.
Alex 27:45
Sorry. I unmuted just to cough. Yeah, I think Kevin, you’re right. I think that because if if Zachary, you know, comes back to the Eagles. And that’s definitely not written in stone at this point. I think that with the emergence of what Dallas gutter is, it’s not because Zacharias has gotten worse. But I think it’s just because that they will cannibalize each other in terms of their productivity and output. So I think I remember when we were having the discussion last year, that you know, these tightened tears, and I think I was a little more bullish on Zachary than you guys might have been, in terms of where I thought he would finish that I had him pretty securely in that second tier. And actually, I might have had him in the first year, if I’m not mistaken. And then we’d have to go back and check. But I had him number three. Yeah. So I mean, I didn’t know I didn’t think that Dallas Goedert would take the step forward that he did. I also didn’t think that Carson Wentz would forget what color jersey his team was wearing on a weekly basis. So I think that that what we saw this year out of Zachary is probably more indicative of what we can expect moving forward. And again, it’s not because I think Zachary has gotten worse. I just think that because you have the emergence of a Dallas Goedert that it’s going to take away from the opportunities
Derek 29:15
I do remember, before that season started that I was saying that I was just not that big a fan of Zach Ertz going into the season, having experienced the Zach Ertz experience in 2019. And really a guy that if you drafted him you were not at all happy with that because you had to take a very early draft pick on that one he was ADP 41 overall pick off the board tight end for and for him to finish as tight in 32. Like, you’re just not happy about that. And even when he was healthy and was on the field, he only had one top 12 tight end finish. didn’t finish inside the top six of tight ends. single week there. So Zachary is a guy that I’m going to continue to stay away from in 2021. Regardless of whether he’s with the Eagles or not, I do believe that the time is starting to catch up with him a little bit there. And really just didn’t look like he was getting the separation that we had come accustomed to seen over the few over the last few years, when he’s running his routes going through is going through that. So no, he’s a guy that I’m just gonna stay far, far away from. I don’t know that. I don’t know, if I have the last pick in the draft and he’s still on the board. If I’m even gonna really take a flyer there. Go ahead and move on over to Dallas Goedert and Dallas garnered finished Titan 20 on the year 46, receptions, 65 targets, 524 yards and three touchdowns. Guys, your thoughts on Dallas Goedert.
Kevin 30:52
So Goedert was another Philadelphia Eagle who was bitten by the injury bug in 2020. And that kind of really put a cap on what he could have been. I think the skill sets there, I think that it didn’t really matter who was throwing him the ball, played a couple games with Wayne’s played a couple games with Jalen Hurts, the output was overall the same roughly. So I do think God is the Titan one in that locker room now. I think he’s die on the rise. He’s the young set of legs. And I expect him to be more and more involved with this offense. I think Goedert is a top 10 tight end for the 2021 season. And that being said, kind of like my speech a couple of weeks ago, I’m not chasing tight ends. Like if I’m kind of waiting a little bit and Goedert falls to me just at the Primo spot, then yeah, that’s fine. But I’m not going to chase a Dallas Goedert and try and get him in the, you know, eighth or ninth round and act like I’m being sneaky on someone or anything else like that. He’s just a guy who he serves a purpose. He has a lot of upside as we saw in 2019. As a tight end, what when he finished tied in three, I believe. So the upsides there, we’ve seen it and still finished as tight end 20 even in an injury riddled season, there’s a lot of Allure towards Dallas got hurt. But I’m not, I’m not going to chase him, I will let him fall, if I can grab him in the 10th. Maybe the 10th might be a sweet spot round. If he falls to me in the 11th I’ll really like him in the 11th anything after that, I will take it to the bank. And I’ll be pretty happy with that because I’ll have a core built around me to sustain some of the up and downs that you get out of the tight end position. But he is in my opinion, clearly the number one option in that room.
Alex 32:51
I’m trying to envision a draft in which Dallas cutter is still available in the 10th or 11th round and I just I don’t
Kevin 32:59
know that there is one No, there is one.
Alex 33:02
That’s to your point though, Kevin. I think that’s probably where you would be most comfortable taking him but i think you know as we do these types of tears and I’m just kind of quickly going through tight ends in my head that I would have him you know almost flip flop I don’t think I would be quite so bullish. But honestly, if he finds the end zone, at least you know, two or three more times he’s not finishing in tight end 20 territory he’s probably finishing easily in tight end one territory not you know, tight end too.
Kevin 33:33
Tight sounds are hard to project, right like you can create usage. You can project his snap count that he’s on the field, you can project routes run, but you can’t project
Alex 33:46
for the tight end spot though it’s a little bit easier to say he probably should have had five touchdowns probably should have had six touchdowns. I think with the tight end spot that it’s a little bit easier to project touchdowns because of the usage that they can get in the goal line situations in the you know, plus 10 territory so I think that that that’s something where you could say yeah, I probably should if he could have gotten another two touchdowns and I’m sure not having watched you know every single snap that he played last year but I’m sure he had opportunities for two or three more touchdowns that probably just didn’t work out. If he gets to you know that five or six touchdown Mark then I think he’s worth taking in the seventh or eighth route. You know, I think that that’s that’s fair and you’re gonna have to follow you know, as most redraft leads are the tight end wave that will happen. You’re gonna have to pay attention to that and if that tidal wave happens where you’re not comfortable with it, you can look elsewhere but I think that he has a better year this year, regardless of who’s playing quarterback honestly, because we know that Carson Wentz likes you as a quarterback and I will maintain till the day I die that young quarterbacks love the tight end because they’re a security blanket. So I just think that he will have I agree with you, Kevin, he will be the tight end one, he will have the better year than Zach Ertz in terms of fantasy points, but I think that he is worth a seventh round pick seventh round grade, if you will.
Kevin 35:17
So Dallas Goedert or Evan Ingram, in general, I’ll
Derek 35:21
take the I’ll take the athletic ability of Evan Ingram, in that case,
Kevin 35:26
Dallas Goedert or Austin Hooper. Reliability,
Alex 35:29
I think, which is tough to say about Dallas Goedert, but I think I’d go got her. I think I’d go over over Ingram as well.
Derek 35:40
I I’m
Kevin 35:41
okay. I’m unsure on where, or no offense.
Derek 35:44
Again, I’ll take the athletic ability of fan over Goedert.
Kevin 35:47
I think I would still this,
Alex 35:49
I think I would still go Goedert here. But that’s because I’m scared of again. Oh, who’s throwing the football in Denver? That’s, that’s that’s not so much. You know, that’s not a slight on no offense by any means. But I just I’m more concerned about the quarterback spot in Denver than I am in Philadelphia. I know at least there’s two capable passers in Philadelphia.
Kevin 36:13
Okay, Dallas Goedert or TJ hawkinson. Since we’re talking about who’s throwing them a football now?
Alex 36:19
Yeah, I think I’d probably like hawkinson a little bit more,
Derek 36:22
I’ll take the guy that only throws the ball six yards down the field to a time, right.
Kevin 36:26
All right, last one got her or kiseki?
Derek 36:29
I’ll probably take a second.
Kevin 36:30
I mean, and the reason I tossed all those names out, right, like, that’s the bottom end of you know, you’re tied in one top end tied into, you know, preseason rankings, right. Like, those are guys that are gonna be drafted at piden, eight through 14 in that range. All those guys are gonna lay in there.
Alex 36:49
I think, you know, the, the point that you’re making also kind of helps the point that I’m making in that, I think that got her it’s right there. In my in my opinion, I think the gods right there in that bottom end of Titan one territory,
Derek 37:01
right, but I don’t want to spend a seventh or even an eighth round draft capital on a bottom in tight end one, right, because when you start looking point differential there, there’s not going to be a ton of separation between tight end 10 and tight end 16. It’s, it’s not like other positions where there’s a huge disparity when you’re talking running back 10 versus running back 16 or wide receiver 10 verse wide receivers, 16 or, you know, even quarterbacks for that matter, where you’re going to get the huge disparity there is in tight end one, maybe tight into and then everybody else when it falls into that. So when you’re talking tight end position there, I’m drafting Kelsey early, and if it doesn’t fall to me, or I have to spend up too much on that one. Well, then I’m going to pump the position almost entirely and start looking in rounds 11 1213 to start taking my tight end, kind of like I did this last year with john smith that and then start filling in the waiver wires on the back end seeing who popped after the first couple of weeks.
Alex 38:06
So that’s why I said grade of for where I would put Dallas Goedert is in that seventh round grade. Obviously that’s different based on how your draft is going to play out because I think we’ve all seen we’ve done enough mock drafts to see that once you know kind of that second tier of tight ends start to go obviously Kelsey kittel they’re they’re gonna go you know, bonkers early, but there’s that wave of way up there too. Right? Yeah, he probably joins that group. But then there’s that wave of tight ends that goes and you’ve got to pay attention to when that goes because you’re gonna you’re gonna miss out on a decent one you know, you’re gonna have to play the you know, hope to get the the Johnny Smith later you know in the in the draft Johnny Smith type I should say, but that’s why I think that’s why it’s the great is, you know, seventh or eighth round when you’re when you’re trying to you know, construct your roster and if you’ve got a Dallas Goedert with your seventh pick. That’s not terrible because odds are you’ve put in you know, two wideouts two receivers and maybe another you know, running back or sorry, not two wideouts two receivers, two running backs, two receivers and maybe another one or two of their mix and match in their seventh pick. Not Not a bad option to take a Dallas Goedert type.
Derek 39:25
No, I think you’re probably right. I think that’s where we’ll probably see him go is around seven, eight. Again, that’s one of those would probably be looking more comfortable around the double digit rounds. Looking back at some of the positional rankings, right like I called him to be tied in 19 finish on the year he finished tight end 20 so felt pretty good about that. That prediction and how that one played out but again, I I almost worry with this Philadelphia Eagles team. Are they going to look very similar to the Colts last year when it came to now I get it That you know Philip Rivers loves to check the ball down and loves to throw the ball the tight end but they had so many different tight ends going there throughout the season that none of them were really fantasy viable and I’m almost concerned that that’s what we may see here in Philadelphia this year as well.
Alex 40:19
I don’t think I would agree with that because I feel Indianapolis had so many tight ends on the roster or Philly really does it so I don’t know that we would say that also still kind of bitter about jack Doyle not being one of those Titans that went crazy.
Derek 40:37
Guys, let’s go ahead and move on over to the quarterback room. And while we all think that Carson Wentz is most likely going to be the starter in the quarterback there, they do have a little bit of controversy brewing and that started over the back half of the season. So Carson Wentz Jalen Hurts are both in that quarterback room. We’ll start with Carson Wentz who finished quarterback 22 last year 251 completions on 437 attempts 2620 yards through the air 16 passing touchdowns, 15 interceptions and additional 52 rushes for 276 yards for five rushing touchdowns. Guys, your thoughts on Carson Wentz?
Kevin 41:21
whence we’ll start the season as the quarterback for the Philadelphia Eagles, but I do think he’s gonna have a short leash. Don’t think that this new coaching staff is going to sit around and let him throw, you know, eight interceptions through the first six games and expect everything to just kind of turn itself around. Health along just the offensive unit as a whole should help with that. But man, it just seems like Carson Wentz has the hips, it like he just hasn’t been able to shake it and whether it’s the amount of hits that he’s taken or the lack of chemistry with receivers, or the lack of trust in the offensive scheme, whatever that was for the final year and a half under Doug Peterson. Carson Wentz looked completely different than he did in was Alex 2018 when he kind of set the world on fire and really had the MVP all sewn up before a late season injury derailed that for him. So we’ve seen the ceiling of Carson Wentz. I, I believe that 2020 was the floor of Carson Wentz. And now it’s trying to figure out where’s the median? Where’s he going to fall consistently? Is he going to be able to use his legs just enough to keep plays alive and extend drives and you kind of cheat? I say cheat, but you get those bonus fantasy points right when he uses his legs. And really is the ball security is he gonna be able to keep the Eagles offense on the field and not make the boneheaded play of just chucking it up to the other team or putting the football on the ground and making that defense have to work time and time again, in a short field situation. So I’m staying clear of Carson Wentz. I am unfortunately the owner of him in a dynasty league and I’m not happy about it at the moment. So I’m pulling for him solely for that reason, but he is a guy that I’m just not targeting. I would rather take a I think I’d rather take a Jared Goff I think I’d rather take a Mitch trubisky at this point with the way he handled the bears the back half the season. Like let’s think about this for a second. And I think Alex is probably gonna want to hang me by my short hairs, but for all intents and purposes, Mitch was a more reliable quarterback when he stepped back into Chicago and got that bears team to the playoffs. Mitch trubisky was a more reliable, more consistent quarterback in his output than Wentz was at any stretch during the 2020 season. So, Carson Wentz is a guy that I I am going to say No thank you, I will fade the crap out of him. I will look for another option somewhere. He is he’s in that realm of Jimmy Garoppolo Teddy Bridgewater through lock, Sam Donald, like that’s where I have Carson Wentz right now. So the Eagles are gonna have to show me something in the offseason for me to offer that mark. But for now, Carson Wentz is not a QB. I’m drafting.
Alex 44:40
Kevin, I see what you’re saying. And I think that, you know, this might just be hopeful thinking but I think that people will be pleasantly surprised. Because I do think that there is a very large camp with your mindset Kevin of I’m just going to stay away from him. I’m not going to touch him. So I think there There’s going to be value for Carson Wentz heading into next year, and I think that he will overshoot that value. Now, whether that’s actually, you know, you know, you’re always you’re always happy if a guy overshoots his value, right? Like, you get a guy in the 12th round, and he puts up, you know, fourth round numbers, whatever, you know, like, you’re very excited about that. And I have a feeling that’s what’s going to happen. I hope that’s what’s going to happen for his sake. Because I do think that there’s a large camp of people that won’t take Carson Wentz they’ll stay away from him with 1000 foot pole. And so those who are willing to take the risk on him, will probably get decent value because they won’t have to spend capital to get him. So I think that that is, at least in my eyes, that’s the more likely scenario to happen heading into next year. I think you’re right. He’s got the yips, there was a breakdown in communication with Doug Peterson. I think Carson didn’t want to run the football as much as Doug Peterson wanted him to run the football because all of a sudden, you know, when you’ve got $100 million contract hanging out there, you’re gonna probably try and stick around so that you can make it to that 100 million dollar contract. So you might protect yourself a little bit more. And when you have the Swiss cheese line that the Philadelphia Eagles had, you’re going to do a little bit more to protect yourself, you’re going to throw the football a little bit earlier than you wanted to. You’re going to maybe make some business decisions if this feels like the outlier versus the rule. The exception to the rule this past season, it just didn’t feel right. Hopefully he goes and visits a sports psychologist and does whatever he needs to do to get back right but because I think there’s a growing population of your mindset Kevin of the I’m not gonna touch him. I think you’re gonna get good value if you do want to take the risk on him
Kevin 46:54
as I’m going through it. I can’t think of anywhere else but to put them besides quarterback 20 so in a normal PPR League, are you going to draft a Carson Wentz to sit on your bench because I think we’re all in consensus, he’s not going to get drafted as a top 12 quarterback. So a team is not drafting Carson Wentz with the mindset of he’s going to be my starter so at that point, why draft a second quarterback when you can play the waiver wire get a Justin Herbert and light the world on fire for free, and you’re not having to give up any capital for it at all. As opposed to I’m going to draft the guy in the 14th and hopefully pans out when you could have taken a flyer on a rookie somewhere and that’s that’s just my mindset, like I have an easier time going through the list and as I’m going through to the divisions in my head, I don’t even know if I could name 12 quarterbacks that I like less than Carson Wentz.
Alex 47:54
So so here’s going to be I think the the, the situation that I think a lot of people will be faced with, and it’s not going to be you know, Trevor Lawrence or Carson Wentz because I still think that people will go with the shiny new toy, even though I think that Carson Wentz probably has a better year this year than Trevor Lawrence just because rookie quarterbacks are it’s I mean, it’s rough man, it is so different. So would you rather have a rookie quarterback, or Carson Wentz throw Trevor Lawrence out there because we understand that he’s probably going to be the consensus number one, but would you rather have one of these rookies that we think is going to go in the first round? You know, the kid out of BYU Lance out of North Dakota State or a fields out of Ohio State? Would you rather have one of those guys? Or would you rather have Carson Wentz those are your options, rookie quarterback or Carson Wentz. Where are you going
Kevin 48:46
sick, the rookie quarterback depends on their landing spot. Truthfully, like I get your question, and I think it’s a valid question after draft day, because it’s one thing for me to say, you know, oh, yeah, I’d take Justin fields over Carson Wentz. Well, if Justin fields goes to the Jets, and I’m not blown away by what the Jets have on offense. Would I take him over Carson Wentz, man, probably not. Trevor Lawrence. Yes, I would absolutely take Trevor Lawrence without the shadow of a doubt over Carson Wentz. I feel like he makes better decisions. I feel like his ability to use his legs and him still being willing to do that gets you those extra fantasy points. And I feel like that division in general tends to have more high scoring games in the AFC south. So they’re warm weather games. They’re not inclement weather, like you see in Philadelphia or in Washington or in the in the Meadowlands, right with the giants. So you don’t have to deal with crappy weather come late in the season as much. So there’s a lot of things that we kind of lean in towards that. So, Trevor Lawrence Yes, in Jacksonville, the rest I think the landing spot might determine what I have say about that.
Derek 50:01
I think I can jump on board with what you’re saying there a little bit. But I think Kevin’s probably closer to the mark there as far as where we’ll see him drafted at qb 20. In this upcoming draft, I think he holds a lot of intrigue, especially in Super flex type of formats. But you look back at 2020 he was the 12th quarterback off the board drafted as qb 12 with an average draft position of the 92nd and a half. pic overall there. So everybody that drafted him got burned this year and got burned pretty good. And a lot of people out there also saw how that played out for those, those fantasy managers there. And I think a lot of people are gonna stay away from him. So I think you’re right, I think there’s some room for him to be a potential value there and be a guy that drastically outperforms where he’s drafted. But, again, right now with that line, and what they’ve got working on receivers. I don’t know that that bounce back is gonna be as far as what you’re thinking. I think that he’ll be drafted at 20 and finish around. qb 16 is about where I would see him finishing right now.
Kevin 51:08
here’s here’s the dilemma that I guarantee you someone’s gonna be looking at in draft day come end of August. They’re gonna be sitting there, they’re gonna be looking at a second quarterback and they’re gonna be thinking Derek Carr, Kirk Cousins, or Carson Wentz.
Derek 51:22
It’s Kirk Cousins.
Kevin 51:24
Yeah, Kirk Cousins are still at the Vikings that I’m taking Kirk on. But I would do I’d take cousins in a heartbeat but cousins seems to constantly carry that stigma as that later around backup quarterback who consistently puts up QB one numbers like by the end of the season, Kirk Cousins finds his way into qb 12 1110. Eight he just finds a way to do it. So that’s that’s, you know, a decision that some people are gonna make and some people are gonna make the wrong decision. I’m we’re telling you right now, Kirk Cousins is greater than Carson Wentz in 2021. I don’t care how many different ways you shake it. Kirk Cousins will be better. So if you’re stuck in that dilemma, there is no well let’s wait and see well see what they got no. Minnesota has better weapons minister has a more balanced offense. Kirk Cousins doesn’t turn the ball over. Kirk Cousins has two top 10 wide receivers, arguably depending on where you have Adam Thielen definitely to top 15 wide receivers and they have a run game to support it. Kirk Cousins is the better option
Alex 52:30
if he’s still in Minnesota
Derek 52:32
and if he’s over at the niners that I’m definitely taking him reuniting with Kyle Shanahan absolutely when we’re in Washington with those two together Kirk Cousins was easily a top 10 quarterback several years their fantasy so
Kevin 52:47
That one cousins would be great for debo and and Luke like cousins and do well there George kittel like oh yeah, that cousins would be just finding that offensive setting. So again, we can get into more of this and we beating the dead horse now but Carson Wentz will be polarizing this offseason because you are going to have some people who just hold on to 2018 just as tight as they can. But you’re going to have a large growing group I believe with a sentiment probably a little bit closer to what my original statement was. is the guy burn me for basically two years in a row. Hands off I’m gonna look somewhere else. Jalen Hurts is also in that quarterback room finishes why our quarterback 35 excuse me, really just over 1000 yards through the air an additional 350 yards on the ground six passing touchdowns, four interceptions, three rushing touchdowns. Guys, are we thinking that Jalen hurts at this point anything more than a backup or almost a taysom Hill type of type of guy as far as his role next year, depending on how deep your super flex league is, would depend on where I take Jalen Hurts, if it’s a deep bench superflex Hell yeah, I’m taking Jalen Hurts. There’s I mean, it’s almost the same thing. Right, I could see them going pretty close in the draft, much like Nick foles and trubisky did for Chicago coming up to the 2020 season where the two of them almost had the exact same IDP because you were taking one or the other. Within the next three picks that other guy was going and and it varied depending on what draft you’re in whether foals or trubisky went first. I think there’s going to be a little bit more of a gap especially by the time we start drafting most likely the Eagles will name Carson Wentz the starter will see reports out of training camp and how they looked in otas and blah blah blah, blah blah all the all the noise that we hear, but that does not change the fact that I do think Carson Wentz has a short leash. I do think the Eagles like what they have in Jalen Hurts, and for a coaching staff that’s just coming in. They want to make a good impression. They want to prove that the Organization made the right hire. And if that’s yanking the quarterback be because he’s turnover prone and seeing ghosts out there. So be it. That’s the decision that they’re going to make and it hurts is my third or fourth quarterback? Because I have a deep superflex League. I’ll, I’ll take it. I mean, hell, he almost won people. He got people to the fantasy championship, right? He didn’t win week 16. But he won weeks, 14 and 15 to get you into that championship game, and then struggled a little bit in week 16. So there’s some upside there that people will remember. And I do think that’s going to cause his ADP to probably be a little bit higher than what I’d be willing to pay for him, because they’re just going to hold on to that. But there is some value there until you absolutely get the Eagles to slam the door in his face and say absolutely not. We’re sticking with Carson Wentz. Right or die.
Alex 55:54
Yeah, it’s all going to come down to what this offseason is and what what the word out of Philadelphia is. And what this new coaching staffs philosophy is going to be, I don’t see them using him as a like a taysom. Hill gadget player, although they could. I mean, he’s spent a second round pick on the guy, you better get something in return out of it. So you’d like to think that they would find some way, but maybe they’ll be a little bit more gadget oriented then, or at least a way to find different ways to utilize him. It could it could very well be similar to what you know, the saints have done with taysom Hill. But I I don’t see, you know, the Eagles named Carson Wentz a starter that I don’t know that there’s a way that I see Jalen Hurts, cracking the lineup in fantasy at least, unless he is a full time starter. It’s just not worth using as a quarterback designation for a guy that isn’t going to take very many snaps at quarterback. If they if they do what they did with taysom Hill and they say oh, he’s got a tight end designation, then maybe we might look at some things and see how you might be able to utilize them but I just I just don’t see it.
Derek 57:11
Guys, I do believe that we’ll wrap up yet another episode of the good old boys fantasy football podcast. Make sure you’re hitting us up on the socials Twitter, Instagram, Facebook at @GoodOldBoysFF we’ve also got the website for your enjoyment now goodoldboysff.com You can also find us on youtube with the good old boys fantasy football podcast YouTube channel for Kevin and Alex. I’m Derek Have a good one. Be safe.